Who said anything about a Ghost, Banshee, or Warthog? There's a plan for vehicular combat, and none of those are a part of it. You're overreacting. Be patient.

On that note, don't look too much in to what Masterz is saying. He likes to mess with things to see if they're fun, if not then we won't do it. Simple as that.

As for B30 Evolved, it's more around 50% to 75% playable. Maybe less. Geometry is mostly there, but there's a hefty chunk that we're still working on, then it's to the true beta stages, and then polish. Then hopefully release, as long as nothing crazy happens. I wouldn't get your hopes up for anything too soon though.

I'm hoping to get some more weapons shown off here soon, but I'm waiting on Lag (who's pretty busy lately) to fix up some animation things.
Edited by BOBTHEGREATTHE2ND on Feb 22, 2013 at 02:23 AM

pile every wraith in the ship into that tiny cylinder called a grav lift. that would teach those humans!

Get some C12 and that would solve everybody's problems.

Why not take all the hunters, wraiths, shadows, spirits, phantoms, ghosts, and shades, and put them on the bottom of the grav lift?

Keyword, new. So it's probably specifically built for that kind of encounter.

edit:
Suggestion time:

So I just played through The CMT SPV2 Beta and the original a10 back-to-back, and here are my thoughts:

The original was clearly designed as short tutorial/intro map and play relatively quick if you know what your doing. That said, it focuses a lot of tagspace on nifty little touches, like all the voice recordings and control diagnostics. That aid it leaves a bit to be desired in gameplay.
SPV2 Beta added a a bunch of new BSP's, pretty much doubling the playtime of the whole map. Of these were large cargo rooms, a push through the vehicle bay, destroyed sections, Chiron, crew quarters, and several rehashes of existing BSP. In addition, many of the encounters were changed up. All of this however, came at the cost of cutting several aspects of the original level.

While I wouldn't go as far as to say you should sacrifice space to re-implement minor unnecessary features, some of them were admittedly pretty cool. The best aspect of the original level was the accumulation of little things and how they all it together so nicely. All in all, a10's niche is being a small map trading in quantity for quality. I feel that's what it should be restored to in SPV3.


The first thing you should definitely do is cut a lot of the rehashed sections. While new BSP's (even bad ones) are exciting and fit the spirit of CE, passing by familiar scenery isn't. A longer level isn't necessarily a better level; I don't need to fight on the same staircase three separate times.

My biggest problem with the new BSP's is that many of them seemed rather bland/barren and pointless other than to lengthen the gameplay. The huge cargo room was a nice breath of fresh air, but it was essentially just an empty space filled with enemies.
The sections ripped and adjusted from the MP level (I believe Chiron) was just a big, blocky, pointless room that should really be cut all together. The vehicle bay and elevator certainly fit the part aesthetically, but were also a little barren. All the flaming warthogs got real repetitive, real quick.
The one extra destroyed section came out of nowhere; you can visibly see a vertical line between the pristine and burned parts of the hull. Otherwise, the custom destroyed part was pretty cool, though it could be expanded/improved, especially in terms of encounters.

There were also all kinds of little glitches/inconsistencies and the like that probably weren't resolved simply because it was a beta.




And so I would like to offer the following suggestions:

I actually rather liked the little section of (what I assume were) crew bunks in the map. While technically pointless, they add depth to the map, though their true potential wasn't fully achieved. It's literally a bunch of nooks and crannies, exploit that. Hide some weapons/heath-packs/easter-eggs in there. Everyone loves teddy bears. I noticed upon first entering this section there was an elite just standing there staring at a bunk. Put a dead marine in that bunk, heck, several of them. Make it look like the Covenant barged in and massacred any sleeping marines. It adds depth/quality to the level and may get the player pumped. All in all, this section could be prime for close-quarters encounters.

I heard that some of the main feature changes are going to be shutting off the lights an gravity. This is wonderful and I'm sure CMT already has plenty of great ideas. Just in case though, I want to stress the importance of "ladder-floors" and "crates-as-vehicles." Nothing says zero-G battle like a cargo-hold full of flying crates and grenades bouncing off the walls (drive-able forklift pl0x). I would like to add that simply for aesthetic purposes, that elevator section should be directly linked to the cargo hold. Finally, as I mentioned the new destroyed section kind of comes out of nowhere. One of it's features is how it slopes downward, I assume to simulate manipulated gravity? If so, it's really obvious how this is done though. It wouldn't be so obvious however, if integrated with prior gravity manipulation instances and "ladder-floors" that allow the enemy to walk on the ceiling/walls. By integrating these features, you can really disorient the player into believing they're experiencing the wonky gravity of a damaged ship.

There were also all kinds of little things. The Hunter encounter was interesting, but unnecessary. It would be better implemented in the openness of a larger BSP like the cargo room, where it's melee attacks can send crates flying. In the very begging you pass by a depleted armory with a bunch of wounded marines. You guys overdid this. Just stick with the populating Bungie originally did. The beginning diagnostics are redundant at this point, though if there's leftover space these could be re-implemented. What I really miss is the little Cortana dialogues and instructions telling you how to melee, etc. If there's space, theses could actually enhance the map. For example, instances of the lights going out provide a perfect precedent to use your VISR, which in turn can become beknownst to the player with the "this-is-how-you-should-use-your flashlight" dialogue box. Also, maybe more close-quarters fights in the maintenance tunnels after you learn how to melee. Finally, I don't know if this intends to be resolved already or not, but cool-it on the Captain Keyes intercom orders. I heard him cycle through the whole: "fire teams on decks 1-9..."->"...secondary positions..."->"all personnel retreat" three times. It's unrealistic and annoying.


I'm sure many of these things have already been considered/implemented by CMT, not to mention new things they haven't told us about. Nonetheless, I look forward to hearing what Masters and the rest of the team thinks of my suggestions.


(ohai, can i haz beta pl0x)
Edited by WWLinkMasterX on Feb 24, 2013 at 03:30 PM

I was thinking it could be a mantis considering that its small enough to fit there and os 3.1 has biped boarding. It would be an older mantis considering halo legends uses the mark I and halo 4 uses the mark IX.

I think that gameplay deviation should be kept at a minimum

in other news, when can we expect the next level to be out?

It seems that all I see on these forums any more is arguments :(

It could hurt the player.
A lot.

Bang! Player got crushed into scrap metal and bloody chunks.

That is why they will probably test it before releasing it to the general public.

I generally try to stay out of this argument, but what? Anniversary was not a rip off of SPv2, it was a graphical overhaul, with absolutely no gameplay changes. No new weapons, no new enemies, nothing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySyCl3Kt07c
Edited by Higuy on Feb 26, 2013 at 08:40 PM

I'm curious to see these comments from Bungie on ODST, iirc they were very quiet on the development of that game after launch.


sorry for the very long time in a response for a very well thought out post. Unfortunately I can only say so much but much of what you suggested is being acted upon (if it hasn't been enacted upon already .


We've refine the level quite a bit, getting rid of the majority of C&P hallways, and replacing and modifying several of the BSPs in the new areas. We are kind of in a tough spot with replacing them, as we have to worry about the pacing, and the physical locations of the bsps. Needless to say, we are very happy with all but one area, which is still being looked into being replaced.

Not everything you've suggested for low grav is feasible for the entire level (we cant do ladder floors in stock areas, we cant overstuff the level with vehicle crate). But low grav in CE is actually much more interesting than it was in other halo games. Everything is effected, even your grenades which can be pretty interesting. Without Havoc and a crate system like h2 and on, there's only so much that can be done.

One of the things being done throughout the campaign (and you may have noticed this in A50), is the reduction of difficulty scripted events. Lots of Cortana's dialog has been restored, as well as things such as the elite at the beginning on higher difficulties. We've also changed some stuff with the hunters, and we have a new encounter that replaces grenade training. The repeating Keyes dialog is something I felt was better to be repeated rather than to cease happening, one of the big complaints was the new areas were to quiet (which I feel now due to several things has been resolved.

I really hope to be able to show you guys a lot more of the level soon, but there is a weapon that the grunts use now that uses the spiker as placeholder, which needs it's own model first, and we need the rest of the updated level textures before we can show it.
Edited by Masters1337 on Feb 27, 2013 at 10:06 AM

Oh man, you're such a puppet. You swallow exactly what your little hero tells you. You didn't actually need to read that text to agree, did you?

OS doesn't magically solve polish nor time. It will do tagspace however. But having more can sometimes be less, as has been shown many times before by you and CMT. SPv3 is a decent attempt at remaking the campaign for the 100th time, but it's still the same old campaign done in an inferior way, aside from OS' magic graphics.

Perhaps one day, you boys will make something revolutionary. Who knows!

To stifle the ideas of others is to snuff out the flames of progression. Ambition is great trait to have when it comes to game design. If you let pessimism hold you back, you'll find that everything you make would be sub-par at best. You say "Perhaps One Day" in a mocking way as if that day isn't now. Yes, OpenSauce doesn't magically make maps look good but with patience (Which the CMT team seems to have alot of,) you could end up making something great. Of course, it would require much more time but you'd have a sense of finality, knowing that you did your best rather than cut yourself short with negativity. Another thing I'd like to stress to you is that opinion is opinion and not everyone agrees on one thing. However, if we went by majority votes, CMT SPv3 is already a success in the eyes of the people who use it. If you think that your say overrules the some thousand people that downloaded the map upon release; The only true problem, here, would be your ego.

Not a single conspiracy claim was made. But you are Masters' puppet nowadays though :-)
You really can't deny that. I've been told you guys do weed-adherol late nighters nowadays.
But hey, if that's what you guys like doing, go for it!

OS solves the problem of polish and time!!! I need like 20 of these things installed

>Implying Takedown will be an OS exclusive Map (as I have stated it is not)

--
Also I might have missed it but are the rest of the CMT maps going to be exclusively YELO or are there going to be both Yelo and Maps like a50?
Edited by MatthewDratt on Feb 27, 2013 at 05:21 PM
Edited by MatthewDratt on Feb 27, 2013 at 06:24 PM

all of cmt's future releases will be os exclusive from what I hear'd. ik TSCE will be os exclusive

http://hce.halomaps.org/index.cfm?fid=6273

Oh dear. Who makes these decisions??

teh lag and the rest of his team.

OS is a requirement because lots of our gameplay and encounters are reliant on OS dependent features. Case and point from our forums.

that is nice masters, though if it plays well fits to be seen. i like the concept though
Edited by killzone64 on Feb 28, 2013 at 10:04 AM

That's one nice looking mantis. What The Maw + The Library needs are Flame-thrower attachments for your Battle-rifles. I'd go all Ripley on them.

Throwing a mantis on that level just has random written all over it I'm afraid.

It's certainly an interesting concept, but canonically, the first known use of the Mantis was in 2553. Prior to this, the UNSC had utilized things like the Cyclops and the Hrunting/Yggdrasil Mark I Prototype. If you intend to include a walker of sorts, I think a variation of the Cyclops or a form of exo-suit would be better-suited.

Edited by Echo77 on Feb 28, 2013 at 01:14 PM

canonically speaking, brutes and drones wouldnt be on the ring either. at this point in the story, brutes had little freedom and were considered unworthy to land on the sacred ring.

The cannon always changes to make room for new content in Bungie and 343's world. In our world, the POA was given some of the most advanced and protoyped weapons for it's original high risk mission, and the Brutes were part of every Covenant ships infantry. The Elites allowed it because they looked at the Brutes as cannon fodder, the Prophets and Brutes wanted it so when the time came, they would have the Brutes in position to overthrow the Elites. Clearly Truth is a fan of Revenge of the Sith.


I've danced with the idea as well. PM them to me so we can go over them.
Edited by Masters1337 on Feb 28, 2013 at 01:33 PM

Bungie wanted to have the brutes in Halo 1, as stated in a Halo 3 Vidoc. The fact that they are not there means that the story is forced to work around it. But the fact that bungie thinks the idea should have been made for that game, is good enough for me.

Oh look, another unoriginal tag that CMT has created once again.

BTW, Happy birthday Masterz!

Well, thats something pretty unoriginal.
e: ninjae'd
Edited by bourrin33 on Feb 28, 2013 at 03:01 PM

I don't see any cause for canon complaints.

This is the original Halo game. It doesn't matter what happens to the story. CMT has full right and flexibility to ignore the other games as this game is not affected by the canon of the other games. The other games are affected by the canon of this game. Changing anything in this game could not be defied by anything but this game as it is the beginning, it is the spark of creation.

It's just like rebooting any canon. Obviously you can't start changing everything in a sequel so that it conflicts with the beginning. However, you can easily change everything from the beginning and move forward again from there.

I'm not entirely sure on whether a mantis would fit into the gameplay regardless but if it's done well, I don't see any valid arguments against it. :/

---

Edited by Jaz on Feb 28, 2013 at 03:06 PM

No. However, the Mantis will feature wings and you will not only be able to wreak havoc on land, but fromt he sky as well!

Right, right. It wasn't so much a complaint as a nitpick on my part. It was an attempt to sate my bias against the Mantis's general aesthetic by providing reasons that it could be replaced by something that better fits my notions of what UNSC equipment should look like.

It's sent down after you've killed the hunters.
I agree with Hilaris if anything this should be featured in B40 to replace the tank. I don't like the idea of just randomly putting in the mantis and only using it for 5 minutes so you can just shoot down some phantoms and then ditch it. Not exactly what I think mantis should be used for in my opinion.